Essay Really runs a dishonest ring

forum/index.php?showtopic=485 - More info

That is a very serious claim to make without supporting it with proof... and factual proof at that! If you can't provide such proof this thread should be deleted.

The link in the post leads to anotehr site that has furtehr links to the original content. By no means should this thread be deleted.

I'm sorry but comments on a discussion board by someone doesn't meet the burden of proof...

What you're passing off as proof would be the same as if I were to say:

Writers Beware has been convicted of rape and molestation of children.

Now, if someone were to post a thread much as you have and put a link to this post as proof of their statements would that make it true?

Thread should be deleted.

Anyone can post information from secondary sources. This is not a police state.

But when that information is unverified and passed off as true you are being libelous and THAT is an actionable offense. Don't think the web can protect you either... one court order and the plaintiff can obtain your IP, name and address.

As far as I can tell the only claim that is "original" in the first post is "More info"; the rest contains a direct quote from another site.


Let's say you know an IP - it then leads to thousands of users on that IP (or is it directly associated with my name and address?)

Gray area Major... If there are provable links between posters like Amy or writersbeware that lead to this site or competition, then an argument can be made that the information was presented to intentionaly damage the company in question for the purpose of gaining profit.

The same argument can be made against several (or dozens) of writers who work/worked for Essay Writers or Academia Research, or similar and claim they haven't been paid for their services. Maybe some of those writers provide private/freelance writing services and want to get rid of their current/former employer and direct competitor?

LOL. It can get so complicated it'd give us a headache. Yeah, there could be pissed off ex-contractors but man if you widened the scope to include them, you'd have no time for your real job... ya know?

But the ones who over power threads with their opinions or agendas by stating things are facts, when in fact they are false... those are the ones to be very careful... they know if you say it enough and loud enough, people will believe...

Well, opinions are just opinions.

Opinions are fine... when opinions are tried to be passed off as fact... well that's just wrong.

If a poster supports their claim with a link to another site (that may contain more detail information about the claim) - is it trying to pass it off as fact? Or there's another rule?

If the poster's links lead ultimatly to a message board with a member stating the claims don't you think credibility, given the nature of the charge, is a bit questionable? I'd be like using a post from a member here as proof of something somewhere else...

I think the reader should be the one to determine if the "claims" or "proofs" are legitimate or not. An experienced reader/researcher can do that.

That is the cause of more trouble than anything else... ;)

The problem is that if they're going to these sites to purchase work in the first place odds are they wouldn't be able to identify what is opinion and what is fact... these scam-artists that haunt these "scam-prevention" sites under the guise of warning future "victims", make me sick. They pose as victims of certain essay sites or present themselves as an authority of essay sites when in fact they're nothing more than "paid bloggers" of a sort for companies directly in competition with the companies they bash.

Take me for example. I've been accused of being an agent for the oversea companies. I haven't promoted one company. From the start all I have been doing is disproving false evidence presented by less than honorable people on this site. As I stated in a post the other week; had I discovered the evidence was factual and true I'd be right beside them condemning the site I was investigating. The fact of the matter is that not one claim she made was true and I pointed that out. Does that make me a representative of the company? Normal people would say no. Agents would say yes. Accusing me and others who disagree with them of being agents is nothing more than an attempt by them to further expand their influence and their false claims and hide the truth about their role in the claims they field.

Some essay companies will even stoop so low as to create a site that presents itself as a sounding board against essay company scams. They use domains ending with .org to lend them a little credibility. Next they contract people, writers they retain to write essays, to bash the competition on the boards. The people who would deceive someone under the guise of helping that person are worse, in my opinion, than any claim made against any of these companies. And yes, I have made it my personal pet project to weed these scums out and expose them for the rats that they are.

What's worse is by doing what some less ethical essay companies do with sites like this one, is they make it virtually impossible for the laymen to come to a "scam-prevention" site and obtain the information they came for in the first place. How are they supposed to know who's credible and who's not? Do you expect them to spend weeks and months as a member before making a decision if X company is less of a farce than Z company because they have to put in the time to find out which members are credible and which ones have agendas? Odds are they're looking for answers now. If you truly want to help people, you do so by being completely honest an open with your claims. You state what is FACT, you state what you THINK is true or you state what is RUMORED to be true. You DON'T pass it all off as fact just because you have a FEELING it is true.

As someone who critices others for every word not backed up by "proof", I'm disheartened to see you post a proofless opinion as fact.



Now you're accusing this site of very devious involvements with no proof.

Um... no I'm not accusing this site of "very devious involvements". I'm sorry, my target readers are those with 10th grade reading levels... so I'll clarify for you... I could see how you saw ".org" and equated that with me accusing this site. What you should have been paying attention to was the word "some". "Some essay companies will even..." at what point did I accuse this site of such behavior?

I post nothing I can't prove. Just as I didn't accuse this site of wrong doing. The simple fact that the site is working means there is no proof that they did wrong. I'm sure that went over your head but hey... what can you do? I have a mountain of proof about the lengths essay companies will go through to win customers over from the competition... long story short, I can back up anything I say and I'm willing to do so off the boards to whoever wants to see it... can you say that?

Do you need me to define that for you? How do you think they "slander" honest companies? Need a compass and a map so you can find the point? Look, I'm not going to argue with you any more on this... just be sure to make it clear if you're posting fact, opinion or fiction. Ok?

A smart buyer (most of them should be smart) first contacts the company s/he may like and discuss it with them. If I want to buy hosting service, the first thing I do is to send an email to the host I may like and ask some questions, like:

- How soon will you set up my hosting?
- What kind of servers do you run?
- How many sites will my site be shared with?
- How often do you do backups?

etc.

Then I expect to receive a reply within a few hours. If the company doesn't reply (or replies in two days), I skip it. Only AFTER I received the reply, I may be looking for other opinions on forums etc. - but I don't have to.

rat....is it just me or are you missing Amy as well? LOL

I think for buying essays the first move is to check out the website carefully.

Look to see what claims the company is making about its location, and do a whois lookup to check when the domain was registered and who is operating it. If company registration details are provided then check these out (i.e. in the UK with Companies House online register of companies). Also check who is processing the companies payments.

Checking online forums is useful, but you can never be sure who is behind the posts (or the forums!)- whether they are promoting their own company or disparaging their competitors. Plus, as we have seen on this site, a small number of very vocal and abrasive posters can dominate threads and may be deterring legitimate clients and writers from posting.

Contacting the company and seeing what response you get in what timeframe is okay, I think, once you have done other checks. I don't think it is beyond the wit of a scammer to reply quickly and convincingly to e-mail enquiries and thus lull you into a false sense of security.

Since we're on the topic of how to check out sites you may want to do business with... My first tip would be to stick with word-of-mouth... If you're friends are using a site and they are satisfied with it, why would you look elsewhere? Go with what you know.

However, if you friends aren't using a "service" that you intend... my first impulse is to ask people I know what they use... if they use anything at all. Beyond that you're pretty much on your own. You can check forums and you can check the site up one end and down the other but you'll never really know unless you're willing to invest hours of time checking them out... if you're skilled enough and willing to invest the time learning if a site is a scam or not I would suggest you put that energy into writing your own paper instead... too often the energy we put forth to cheat is greater than the energy that we would expend doing the work ourselves.

Very true.

I think personal recommendations are the best way to go, though unfortunately many people don't want others to know that they use essay companies.

I should also add... if you're looking to write for a site that you should be skilled enough to dig up the truth without having to rely on sites such as this one... if you're not skilled enough... then you really have to ask yourself if you should be writing papers.

I think I can speak for most people here when I say that you are a rude jerk. You personally insult anyone who disagrees with you. From where I stand, you'e nothing but a bully.

Anyway, your bold quote has nothing to do with my quote.


Where is yrou proof of this?

I have no problems with people who disagree with me, so long as they're not trying to deceive others in doing so. I have no idea is your original post's claims are true or not... neither do you... there was no proof for us to follow... that's where I take issue and that's where you and I ran into a problem. I called you out and voiced my opinion that you are Amy with a different user name and then, if memory serves, you began the name calling.


This is a well documented practice. I was making no such claims against anyone in particular. The practice can be sourced on the AP News Wire, if you're a subscriber and other various trade publications and such...

Given your problems understanding my posts I took the liberty of putting certain key words that state my meaning, in bold print.

I'm sorry, but you can't wiggle out of this one. You specifically said "writers they retain to write essays." That is a specific claim against the specific company in the specific industry.

If your claim is factual, please show me the source in AP News Wire that mentions "essays".

are you serious? "they" meaning the companies that do this sort of thing... buy a dictionary.

Why are you being so rude to me personally? Can you please provide the evidence to support what you have stated as fact?

Be polite and provide the evidence so that people can stop thinking you are a hypocrite.

This has been addressed in the other thread... I will not address any further issues on this thread... bouncing the same topic in two threads is confusing to some readers as they are at times getting half the view.

And I'm sorry if you're taking my words as an insult but you are the one trying to twist my words... I have nothing personal against you or Amy, or anyone else for that matter. Per your request of "evidence" to support my statement: Find it yourself, I've made no specific claims against any specific company and therefore need not to divulge the source of that statement. You and a few others have made accusations against specific companies and THAT is why I'm asking for proof. It's common knowledge in this industry and easily researchable if you desire "proof" that this sort of thing happens with "scam-prevention" sites. Should I ever name a company directly you can bet you trailer that I will back such a claim up with valid evidence... just the same as I expect; demand, from you and your fellow posters.

You are refusing to provide the evidence because none exists. I'm just askign you to quote a single word from the AP News that mentions any of these companies or "essays". If you can't do that, then you are guilty of the exact same thing that you have crucified Amy for.

If you can't understand the answer... I don't know what to tell you.

I am referring to your claims that the AP News supports your statements.

You made very specific claims. If you can't admit that you made the same oversight that you have crucified Amy for, I'm not going to stop focsuign on that.

Keep focusing all you want... there is a very real difference between my statement and Amy's allegations. Her comments named specific companies, which can be considered libelous if false... and they were false.

Mine is about an industry on a whole. It singles out no specific company or person and in no way meets the definition of libel. Therefore, I need not support my claim as I required you and Amy to do with yours. I am not stupid enough to make a statement about something I'm investigating that would require me to reveal sources thus putting a case at risk. The support of that statement is out there... Google it!

What she did would be akin to saying "RCA scams their artists out of record sales money."

That is a specific claim made against a specific company and it is libelous unless you have evidence to support it and that evidence has to meet the criteria of evidence to do so.

What I did would be akin to saying "Record labels often scam their artists with tricky contracts designed to take their money from sales".

My statement mentions nobody specific nor does it mention a company. It states that scams exist in the recording industry and gives a breakdown of one of the scams. Like my essay statement, it is easily researched by the reader who with a little effort can find related news stories or articles that spell out the scams and who has been busted.

You're really beating a dead horse on this one. However, keep clinging to it as a life-line... perhaps with enough effort you can make it seem like I'm holding a double standard.

My horse is still alive and kicking. I don't think you addressed my request at all. Where's the quote from AP News that supports your claim about essay sites? I quoted you and you know what you said. You're just too stubborn to admit you did the same thing that you criticize Amy for (you claim that she stated opinions as fact) because you know that that will prove you a hypocrite. What you've done is even worse actually. YOu completely fabricated some nonexistent evidence to help support yrou position against Amy. You stated as fact something that is absolutely NOT fact. There is no AP News report that I can find. Here it is again...

Quoting: rat289, Post #17
"Next they contract people, writers they retain to write essays, to bash the competition on the boards."

By "they" you mean an essay company. Since you only post facts that you can prove with hard evidence, where are your copies of the shady contracts? If you don't have copies of the contracts, there is no way you can prove yoru claims to be fact that ANY essay company hatched a devious plot to contract their writers to post here. You criticized Amy for this type of thing constantly. YOu criticized me for a similar act after my first ever post about information on another site.

Quoting: rat289, Post #28
"The practice can be sourced on the AP News Wire, if you're a subscriber and other various trade publications and such..."

Where is this AP News report that mentions the word "essays" or deals with essay writing fraud in general? I would like to read it and come to my own conclusion.

No it isn't the same... and it will never be the same, no matter how many times you take my quotes out of context in a misleading attempt to prove you right. I'm talking about an industry as a whole. Anyone without an agenda would see the difference between what Amy did and what I did. I have to ask, what is your agenda? You seem to care an awful lot about disproving facts that clear essaywriters.net.

Per my comment, I don't know how else to explain the difference to someone who doesn't accept what their own eyes read. Google it, wiki it or hit the AP up and search for it. It's out there for you to find and it's easy to find, unlike Amy's claims which took three people the better part of two days to uncover. If you don't think it happens you're as disconnected as Amy. If you're trying to act like it doesn't happen then you MAY very well be one of them (it = the topic of my entire quote). Sorry but I have addressed the difference between what Amy did and what I did (on more than one occasion) and I will not respond to any more partial quotes you put up that are presented out of context to serve your claims... you emphasize the word "they"; however, if you'd have quoted the whole paragraph you would see the emphasis belongs on the word "some"...

Some essay companies will even stoop so low as to create a site that presents itself as a sounding board against essay company scams. They use domains ending with .org to lend them a little credibility. Next they contract people, writers they retain to write essays, to bash the competition on the boards. The people who would deceive someone under the guise of helping that person are worse, in my opinion, than any claim made against any of these companies. And yes, I have made it my personal pet project to weed these scums out and expose them for the rats that they are.

When the partial quote taken out of context is read it does appear as if I'm singling a company out... when in reality that wasn't what I was doing. If you have to resort to misleading the readers of this thread to discredit me then I must be doing ok with my argument. As I said before, keep twisting my words... eventually they'll look like you want them to, even though they won't be my words anymore... just like some members here twist the adverts and comments involving the sites they bash here... twist and twist till they can frame the company as criminal... a normal person would have to ask just what are their motives in doing this? Anyone with half a brain can field a reasonable theory (now here's the tricky part... this is only opinion), that these people have a vested interest in the failure of the sites that are bashed.

You can keep asking for an answer you've already gotten and make yourself look more and more like Amy or one of these types I've discussed here or you can do the grown up thing and realize there is a huge difference between my quote and Amy's actions.

It peaks my interest to know why you are so determined to protect essaywriters.net. What have they done for you? You can barely bring yourself to admit that they use false advertising.

Why can't you just post the AP News evidence that you claim exists? You can post everything else, but not that? You even offered to give me with yrou personal information (without me asking) so that I could conduct some some type of background check on you, but you won't post a simple link to an article that you claim exists? Why not? If it exists, post it here so that everyone can read it. That would be a lot easier than writing another 445-word post, wouldn't it?

That was 445 words!!!! I'll have to open all the word docs I have for this site and see how many words I've typed... Maybe they, who ever they are, are paying me by the word...huh? hehehe Let's see what you do with that quote!

I'm not asking for anything except the link to the AP News article that you claim exists and used to strengthen yoru argument against Amy. Why won't you let me read it? That would bury Amy's position for sure, wouldn't it? Either the article exists and you can give it to me, or it doesn not exists and you lied. Whihc is it?

It does exist and I can give it to you but it is evidence so I can't give it to you... understand yet? You have to find it yourself... it's out there... if I give it to you it will cause me more headaches than you can imagine... and I'm not talking about here. I'm not looking for a fight with you, this is just the way it is. Amy's position was buried last week... she doesn't need any more dirt.