Posts by Inquisitor

Inquisitor

Oct 02, 2009

General Talk / Exact Term Papers vs Student Research Organization [29]

I know I'm probably stepping into a minefield here, but what the heck... as a qualified lurker on these pages, I might as well step into the spotlight with a biggie :)

Student Term Paper

I've been reading up on the Exact Term Papers vs. Student Research case, and bloody hell it was torturous, but worth it in the end. This is a case that gets mentioned a lot on here. Might it be useful to get straight what actually happened?

Now I might be wrong, and if I am then please just let me know. I have no agenda here, I just want to see if I'm right about my interpretation of what happened.

My understanding is that Exact Term Papers (a Pakistani company) filed a complaint against Student Research (a New Jersey company) in a New Jersey court. Exact Term Papers were claiming that Student Research operated a site called essay organization and were using it to defame the other company.

Prior to this, Exact Term Papers had filed subpoenas that had led them to proof that Student Research owned essay organization.

It was agreed that Student Research would respond on February 2008. On that date, Student Research admitted to owning essay organization, but defended that site, claiming that all the information on it was true. Furthermore, Student Research counter-claimed against Exact Papers for copyright violation.

Student Research then filed a Rule 11 letter (something to do with frivolous court actions?) regarding Exact Term Papers' subpoenas, i.e. the subpoenas that Exact Term Paper had used to determine that Student Research owned essay organization. (You still with me?).

Because of some mistake when pursuing the subpoenas, Exact Term Papers' attorney quit.Exact Papers then decided to 'go it alone', i.e. pro se and without an attorney, but this isn't allowed for a corporate entity in New Jersey, so the judge entered a default ruling against Exact Term Papers, to the sum of $k, relating to the copyright claim (over some papers, I think?).

Meanwhile, in Pakistan, Exact Term Papers filed a suit against Student Research for damages (not sure what exactly for - anyone? the essay organization thing?) and because Student Research chose not to contest this in Pakistan, Exact Term Papers won a default judgement of $m (seriously!?!?).

Phew. Okay, I think I'm still with it so far. Can you tell I'm not a legal expert?

So the result seems to be that Exact Term Papers was awarded $6m damages against Student Research in a Pakistani court, Student Research was awarded $k damages against Exact Term Papers in a New Jersey court, and neither side has much hope of receiving any money from the other, because of the different jurisdictions.

Now, we come to the question of site ownership. There seems to be some confusion, with some sources claiming that some sites that Student Research claimed were owned by Exact Term Papers were, in fact, merely hosted on the same servers, and were owned by various other companies, including one called BCO(?).

So... I'm sure some of this is wrong, so I'd love it if people would step in and correct the bits that are wrong, and add other details. It just seems this topic gets talked about soooo much, it would be useful (at least to me) to get to the bottom of it.

Incidentally, essay organization now seems to be parked, up for sale, and currently owned by Win Ltd, whoever they are.

Inquisitor

Oct 02, 2009

General Talk / Exact Term Papers vs Student Research Organization [29]

Hi, I have no problem with that. Before the thread's deleted, or in a PM, could you point me in the direction of what you consider to be a reliable account of it all? I'm sure you'll agree that, with all the apparent misinformation, it's a right old kettle of fish!!

Inquisitor

Oct 03, 2009

General Talk / Exact Term Papers vs Student Research Organization [29]

So what about the court case in Pakistan? Did that even happen? And what was the original problem with essay organization, was it a site like this one, but run by a particular company, and it got closed down for peddling lies, or allowing libel?

I must confess the reason I got interested in the case is the implications in terms of jurisdictions. These two companies seem to each have whopping judgements against them, but neither side looks like it'll have to pay up. I'm actually a third year undergrad law student and I'm thinking of doing a research project on the subject (and yes! I'll write it myself!!), it's quite an interesting area.

Anyway, if I go ahead, I'll let you all know if I find out anything explosive, like counsel for the defense had two heads or something :)

The facts of the Pakistani case were never documented.

P.S. A court case can't go undocumented. If it happened (and I'm not saying for sure that it did), there'll be documents, however hard they are to find; that difficulty may be down to the nature of the Pakistani court system, which is notoriously behind-the-times when it comes to things like putting legal documents online.

Inquisitor

Oct 03, 2009

General Talk / Exact Term Papers vs Student Research Organization [29]

Mod, please delete this thread before it leads to even more misinformation!

I respectfully disagree.

I'm sure I'm not the only one who was confused, and it does give everyone a chance to put the record straight. Some people on here have certainly given the impression that there was a judgement against SR, which does appear to be wrong!

If a thread like this had existed in the first place, I'd never have had to ask, so maybe it's a good idea to have it as reference? Hmm, I'm probably just proving why I'd be a bad mod...

Plus this is a rare thread that (so far) hasn't descended into 'Shut up', 'No you shut up', 'No you shut up', 'right let's have a vote on who should shut up' :)

Inquisitor

Oct 03, 2009

General Talk / Exact Term Papers vs Student Research Organization [29]

*Sigh* I read a lot of threads, I saw how volatile this place is, I tried to couch everything in uber-friendly and open terms, and for a moment I thought I'd succeeded...

I really am beginning to suspect the nature of your so-called interest.

I've been very clear about why I'm interested.

I was very careful to state that I was unsure of my facts, and that the reason for my post was so that others could correct what I'd got wrong. I came here because I knew that some people on this site know a lot about this case, and I wanted to hear from them.

We directed you to the court ruling, to a legal document

Yes. Thank you. I'd already seen those papers, but I still appreciate your help.

You came back with questions regarding the Pakistani case, insinuating that the case is genuine and that SR lost.

I think I was pretty reasonable on that score. I asked. You explained. Again, thank you. Believe it or not... I believe you!!!

Where did I insinuate that it was genuine? Do you know what that word means? I merely left open the possibility, which I think is reasonable. For what it's worth, I don't think the Pakistani case is genuine - I think it's, as another member suggested, propaganda - but I still leave open the possibility that it's genuine, until I've finished my background research.

The one thing I do believe is that you know nothing of the law.

Wrong.

If (that is a very very big if) the Pakistani courts ruled against SR, it was by default.

Didn't SR, technically, if we're being pedantic, win on default?

I've explained why I asked about all this. Now I'll go off and put together my research proposal. Or maybe I should look for someone to do all the writing for me... any recommendations? :p

Anyway, thanks, you have all been genuinely helpful!

Inquisitor

Oct 03, 2009

General Talk / Exact Term Papers vs Student Research Organization [29]

Exact Term Paper withdrew when the tide turned against it

As I understood it, their counsel dropped the case because Exact Term Paper had misled him, and he claimed that he'd never have taken their case if he'd known the truth. Exact Papers were then unable to find another legal representative, which speaks volumes about the legitimacy of their case!

I believe I owe you an apology

Thanks, I admit it's hard sometimes to read someone's intentions on the internet, so I understand. And I think that's the first time anyone's ever apologise to me online! Score! Sorry if I seemed unreasonable at any point :)

Inquisitor

Oct 17, 2009

General Talk / Exact Term Papers vs Student Research Organization [29]

Remember me? I found out one interesting thing to add to the discussion we had before. There definitely was a court case in Pakistan.

On August 2009, at the High Court in Karachi, suit 772/2008 appeared before Mr. Justice. This was Exact Term Papers vs. Student Research. It was listed in the court files as 'Final Hearing / Disposal'.

On September 2009, at the same court, before the same judge, there was another hearing related to the same case. Both appearances were, obviously, subsequent to prior appearances, details of which I'd try to ferret out if I had the inclination.

As my legal background is UK-based, I've been working to get my head around the Pakistani legal system, which is very different in some key respects. But I thought some of you would appreciate the update. On a personal note, I've decided I'm not going to focus on this case for my dissertation, but it was interesting research nonetheless.

By the way, I'm not trying to stir anything up. Over and out.

Inquisitor

Oct 17, 2009

General Talk / Exact Term Papers vs Student Research Organization [29]

Sorry, I thought there was some doubt about whether the Pakistan ruling happened at all. Someone said:

there is no ruling against SR in any court, in any country

which is not true.

Otherwise, Pheelyks, WRT & co., I agree with 99.9% of what you say.

P.S. I think I chose a bad username. 'Inquisitor' makes me sound like I'm some evil nutter with a point to prove. My name was, in fact, an obscure and somewhat geeky 'Red Dwarf' reference :)