I'm inclined to believe likewise. There are of course worse conclusions that may be drawn from her irrational fears and unfounded anger - some forms of psychosis for instance. But "adolescent" seems more likely.

I think from the most recent discussion it is very obvious that she lacks basic comprehension skills. She's skilled with words the manner of a plumber - knowing where all the stops and commas go, but without understanding.

I'm signing off here too.
Bye.

3 posts since Rat and I asked for your story and there's STILL no response.

I think I am one such. Thanks to both rat and paperchaser for your well-balanced comments and the extraordinary perseverence you've exhibitted in uncovering the facts. The posts on this furum have been dominated by Amy this far, and until the last sequence of posts I myself was quite convinced that essaywriters.net was not a legally incorporated entity at all. I'm grateful to have a fuller account of the facts.

I'm still a little puzzled about the Ukranian connection though. I believe it began with one of Amy's posts based on translations of a Russian forum. Is there any truth at all to that claim?

Frankly, I'm surprised that people would take as must trouble as you have in the pursuit of something of seemingly trifle importance - a dispassionate conclusion. That is not, however, to cast aspersions on your motives - rather to commend your sense of integrity and fairness. (I really hope you're not from essaywriters.net!)

Whilst everyone else who had a complaint against essaywriters.net has substantiated it with anecdote, I don't believe Amy has. Perhaps its time for her to come out with her story. I still don't think Amy is racist. From her perpetual state of high excitement, or in the way she fiercely defends attacks against her qualifications, and now in the way that she cannot admit a mistake, I think it is easy to conclude that she only suffers from immaturity.

One last thing, I'd like to tender an apology for the anti-American jibes in my post in the "calling a spade" thread. It must not have been pleasant for the two of you to read and was entirely inappropriate on my part.

Hey Saba,
You're right about that, and its a point I wanted to make, but didn't get around to making.
Although your client in this instance was American, I get the impression that a majority of clients are in fact students of other nationalities working through their college degrees in the US/UK. Perhaps I'm wrong about that.

Which site do you use? How long have you been at this? Do they pay you?
Anyway.. on a different note, its too bad both our teams crashed out of the world cup eh?

Rat,
My first impressions on the ethics of the scheme were identical. But some of the testimonials at Custompapers.com beg a reconsideration of the issue. For instance tlumaczenie.com/graduate.html - where a physiotherapist admits to using the service and claims that it gave him more time to gain valuable hands-on experience in treating patients!

Because I'm from essaywriters.net. BOO.

Thank you rat.
I'm just wondering, has there been any discussion on this forum about the legitimacy of this industry as a whole? It seems to me, at least in India, that you would not be able to organise a business of this sort. It comes squarely within the description of "cheating" (inducing a person to act in a way they would not otherwise act - i.e inducing universities to award degrees).

Further, if there exist analogous provisions in other jurisdictions, I think the heroic attempts by some to physically locate these organisations is futile because after that, what? You cannot possibly sue them, imho, because most jurisdictions also require that the plaintiff approach the court with "clean hands". So a customer cannot possibly sue.

I'm curious to know how companies like ukessays.com or custompapers.com are able to maintain their claim to legitimacy.
I find this the most fascinating aspect of this industry by far. That it can only exist in the nebulous amoral nether world of the internet and that redress for complaints are only possible again, on the internet.

Being a crook in UKRAINE cannot possibly be any worse than being a crook anywhere else.


Here are three instances. I don't want to press the issue. You may of course think (THINK) you are not being prejudiced ("prejudiced") but it is quite manifest. Others have said it before. Like I said, I don't want to press the issue. You're entitled to your prejudices.

It doesn't. Of course. (Custompapers.com may be hiring ESLs)

I've been following the discussions on this forum with great interest over the past 24 hours because I'm a new writer at essaywriters.net and am somewhat suspicious about their ability/willingness to pay.

Full Disclosure: I am an Indian/Pakistani (Since Amy likes to fuse our identities and I'm not actually that interested in prying us apart).

This does NOT mean, automatically, that I've been hired by essaywriters.net in a damage-control exercise.

I've never been to the US, have lived all my life in a small town in India/Pakistan and yet I aspire to be a writer in English. (*gasp* *shock & awe*) Because it's the language I'm most comfortable expressing myself in. (NEVER start a sentence with "Because").

This lengthy preamble because I want to avoid being baited as some of my unfortunate compatriots have.

Here's what I like about essaywriters.net.
1) They're NOT stuck up about hiring Indian/Pakistanis who can write. So if I want to be a work-at-home writer in this industry (we Indian/Pakistanis are also entitled to desire that kind of life), and I don't want to leave my country AND I have some degree of competence or pretended competence at what I do.. where do I begin? (Here's Amy's cue to rant about how this *isn't* a forum to promote good sites! Go.. elsewhere for that. WHERE?).

2) They give amateur writers a chance to get paid for writing, or to try at any rate. Ok, so maybe the average Indian/Pakistani ESL writer is incapable of writing an acceptable US "college" thesis. But that's really a very blinkered way of looking at the market and pretending that the ONLY buyers you get are dishonest gullible redneck Master's and Ph.D students in the US. I think the market for gibberish (two page write-ups on c*ap) is as large as the market for arcane scholarly dissertations. And (*groan* not a sentence beginning with "And"!) I have hunch that's where there's space for us oily goat-milking Indian/Pakistanis to make ourselves useful. As self-deprecatory as that sounds, even the worst of us is useful because we are completing the bulls-i* projects of clients whom your Ph.d saturated industry is too stuck-up to service. Gradually, very innocuously we're graduating your country's finest. In that process we're graduating ourselves. What's really going to scare the Amys of the world is if somehow, we oily goat-milking Indians actually begin to produce "US standard" (oxymoronish, no?) dissertations. Ofcourse that thought has never occured to her/him.

3) The work is interesting! Really. So, (tut tut) I'm not ONLY on a trip of looting hapless US/UK/Canada students of their bottom-dollar. I find that some of the projects on this site are really interesting and are issues, the study of which would add to my own "perspective". I just finished a somewhat complex project in a subject that lay in the borderlands of my area of specialization, which required me to digest a lot of material that I wouldn't have encountered in the ordinary course. (Can't suppress a boast here: I got a "Very satisfied" review from my customer for my very first project. Yay.) Maybe essaywriters.net won't pay me at the end of it, but like the user "rat" says, my insurance is that I can copyright "my" paper. And although it is unacceptable not to be paid, there's some consolation to be gained from the fact that we're enriched in other ways. This is not only an industry which produces "non-plagiarised" material - it is also in the business of originality.

4) They paid some of the members of this forum *after* explicit attacks vented against them. That shows a creeping degree of good-faith that isn't easy to dismiss off-hand.

The things that make me uncomfortable about essaywriters.com:
1) Obviously, they're not paying on time. I can see how that can be disastrous to those who rely on this as their primary source of income. I wish they'd take more care and invest more time in their primary resource. Or atleast invest some more in retaining their better writers. As Amy pointed out, I have a hunch they'll hire anyone. I advance my own admission as evidence. But there has to be a mechanism to ensure that the better writers amongst the lot are treated with more dignity - not necessarily paid better although that would be ideal. Perhaps they ought to build up quasi-personal relationships with their veteran/trusted writers. Pay them even for projects that don't pay up. I'm sure they have the money for it.

2) They evidently don't back their own writers. I refer to one of the instances where plagiarism was indicated in the "Works Cited" page. This is alarming, more so because I am a lazy referencer. I prefer to copy/paste citation entries where available, instead of reconstructing them from scratch. But this is indicative of their apathy towards their own writers. It's not something which immediately brands them as evil, but it does make them impossible to ever trust to any great degree.

3) They don't let you communicate directly with the client. They do have a link that lets you send a message to the client, but I'm fairly certain they're screening all messages to and from the client. It takes inordinately long for the client to respond and I can't believe that is because he/she only accesses the internet once a day. It is annoying because it holds up your work when you need an important clarification from the client.

4) Where on earth are they located? I must admit this is the most disconcerting aspect of all. I can understand that admitting you're based in the Ukraine, and then attempting to sell to a primarily American/UK market will ensure your business is a non-starter. Especially when purchases come with prejudices of the sort Amy harbours. But it doesn't make it very easy for us to trust them. Its curious that the user "Beth" claims to be an accounts officer of some sort for the outfit. I imagine she would have an office somewhere..

Other things I wanted to talk about:
1) I cannot stress enough how valuable this site is - even as solely anti-essaywriters.net as it may seem. I applaud the vitriol of such dedicated members as Amy and others. I think the existence of the possibility of a backlash from their writers alone will either compell them take remedial action or will bring them down. Both of which are positive outcomes. I'm secretly rooting for the former. I hope the user "Beth" is paying attention.

2) There was a suggestion that we Indian/Pakistanis are undercutting the wages of the good American Ph.D expert essay-writers (ofcourse writers never earn "wages". That's the disgraceful stuff labourers earn.). But then again, maybe that's in fact why this market is viable at all. All the fraud essay writing sites that dangle hopes in front of beleagured out-of-cash students in the US/UK/Canada, invisibly line the pockets of the Custompapers.com-s and ukessays.com-s. People who can only afford $8 a page aren't your primary customers, but that doesn't mean they're not customers at all. I know you want to set up an intergalactic empire of pure-bred US/UK/Canada essaywriters who work from home. But maybe there's place even for the riff-raff to set up shop. It's certainly the riff-raff who're your clients. (Oh Come ON!)

3) Data on Alexia indicates that Indians are the top visitors at essaywriters.net (alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details?url=essaywriters.net). Hm. For really surprising results check Custompapers.com's entry (alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details?q=&url=custompapers.com)

4) I dont know if any of you are struck by how bizarre this industry is, where both the buyers and the real sellers (the actual writers) operate in shadows - being unable to fully disclose their identities. It's fertile ground for scam essay webistes to make a killing.

5) What wondeful times we live in.

I'm sorry if this sounds like an Anti Amy entry. I'm sure he/she'll have a lot to say in return. Racist is the wrong word to apply to him/her. It's the supreme condescension and the cavalier ease with which (s)he's prepared to dismiss countries and cultures (OfCOURSE they're a scam. They're from UKRAINE) that's irritating.

On the other hand, I'm really in awe of the command he/she obviously possesses over the English language. I can't help being very self-conscious in this regard. I haven't run this entry through a spell check and I hope you won't be its substitute - as you have with other users. I disclaim proficiency in the apocryphal "American English" at the outset.

It was a pleasure to read the more balanced opinions of users like "coder" and "Dylan" and a real treat to receive advice on writing from the "rat". (Definite sign that we've progressed as a planet, when we can say the last part of that sentence without being considered a lunatic)

Thanks for all.