The Problem with ESL Websites and Writers

Contrary to popular assumptions, neither fear of competition nor racism fuel our opposition to ESL sites and writers.

The opposition to many ESL writers (there are several excellent ones here and none of what I am about to say applies to them) is that they are uneducated and do not speak English with any degree of fluency. We are similarly opposed to unqualified native English language writers.

If you want to work in this industry and write for students studying in the United States, UK, Canada or Australia, you must have the following qualifications:

1) English-language skills which are better than those of the average native speaker.

2) A solid education.

3) First-hand, experiential knowledge of the Western education system (remember, you are writing for Western educational institutions).

4) An insider's knowledge and understanding of Western culture. You cannot speak as a Western student if you do not understand the West's culture or worldview. While I would not go so far as to uphold Kipling's "East is East and West is West," there are fundamental differences and, they show in a myriad of ways.

ESL writers have countered the above countless times. Asif, Chacha and Researcher (to name but a few) argue that language does not matter and it is all about knowledge and content. Not at all true. If you cannot clearly communicate knowledge, it is worthless; if you cannot understand the reading material (because your English is awful), then you have nothing of substance to say. One of the simplest assignments ever is the `article critique' - how can you critique an article of you do not understand it?

Knowledge is, of course, inarguably important but it is not the only important factor here. Many of you have not even been taught the proper citation methods and do not know the difference between APA and Harvard. You think Ibid is the last name of an author and that op. cit. is a spelling mistake. YOU USE BULLET POINTS THROUGHOUT ESSAYS AND RESEARCH PAPERS AND DO NOT KNOW HOW TO STRUCTURE A DISSERTATION!

Believe it or not, academic writing is a profession, a proper job. Many of us make a very good living in this industry and respect our work. We do not want unqualified, illiterate $2 per page people here as it gives us a bad name.

As for ESL websites, our opposition is based on the following:

1) You hire unqualified people like Researcher, Chacha and Asif.

2) You claim that your writers are Brits and Americans when they are not.

3) You claim that your writers are academically qualified (minimum MA) when the majority have no academic qualifications at all.

4) You claim that you are American and British when you are not.

5) You scam writers and customers and give us all a bad name.

Basically, we do not like you because you are dishonest cheats and liars. Be truthful with your customers; tell them who you really are; reveal your real nationality and that of your writers. Be honest and we will respect you. Remain dishonest and we will continue to fight and expose you.

A legless man can be an olympic sprinter as long as he/she "believes" in the existence of kinetic energy and "understands" the mechanics of human motion. Who dares to disagree with me?

The lack of an immediate rebuttal from the civilized world means that I win!

My name is Researcher-don't forget it!

Sounds just like the Imbecile :) Had me laughing

See, even I make an occasional gaff. The difference is that I recognize it.

... and don't launch into a maniacal tirade and have an epileptic fit, if pointed out

IDIOT.. Most of ESL writers are more educated than you.. as for as your this assumption goes....... idiot...... be reminded that top people (on technical side) at Google, Apple, Microsoft, Oracle are from India and Pakistan..... that speaks their abilities.... What is your qualification? I asked this question to pheelyks too and he failed to answer than and I am sure you will too because you must be a simple fuc*ing undergraduate.. Most of Americans and Brits cannot afford to study beyond undergrad degrees and it is a proven fact.. if you are really from Britain you must know what is the ratio of home and foreign students at UK universities?


No...... you write mostly for ESL Students having English writing skills as good as their ESL Writers have......


You are ignorant piece of shi*.. because u do not know the quality of education in countries like India and other countries.... to give you an example, one business school from China and India is in top 20 of ft.com list... idiot... they are producing better graduates than you think.......

If they hire unqualified writers how come they are surviving in an industry which requires extensive knowledge?
Yes their writers are Brits and Americans because money can lure any one.. just scroll through the list of writers at essaybrunch and you will See who they are..

Majority of them have good knowledge and you are ignorant piece of shi*.. you claim that you are Brit but you are not,, you are a cheat yourself..

Be honest yourself and world will stop kicking your As*..

Truth about the legit company who claims to hire only doctrol level writers but pheelyks the Phat As* is a simple piece of shi* with an undergrad from a pathetic university and same goes for WRT: essayscam/forum/ot/strange-connection-1498/

The thread doesn't say anything about my or WRT's credentials. And we're not the ones reduced to vulgarities and random accusations, Researcher. Our posts make sense, which is certainly a sign of our intelligence if not our education.

Why are you posting random links to other threads, Researcher? It doesn't exactly help your case...or help customers looking at this site...or doing anything productive at all, really.

[quote=pheelyks]The thread doesn't say anything about my or WRT's credentials. And we're not the ones reduced to vulgarities and random accusations, Researcher. Our posts make sense, which is certainly a sign of our intelligence if not our education.[/quote

Really? Shall i show you the kind of vulgarity and random accusations and racial abuse that you and your friends use here? you are again ignoring the very question about your education? you are an ET WRITER, ET claims it hires only doctoral level writers that means you should be holding a Phd but if you are not a PhD than you and ET are cheaters........

These threads shatter the ESL and Non ESL myth....... these threads indicate how so called legit companies from US/Russia are cheating their customers..

No, they don't. They simply contain more of your and Melissa's insane ramblings and accusations.

Again, you're wrong. These threads contain you making the same basic assertion without any sort of proof or evidence whatsoever.

Great...... this is the modus operandi of you and your gang here...... refute everything that is against you and start rambling against others.... do you have a slight bit of self respect?


This forum is full of accusations that you and your friends made here and that too without any proof......

Give me something to refute! posting links to threads where you make the same claims as you're making here without any proof isn't refutable; it fails on its surface.


Show me one.

1. That is an utterly false claim. Of course, you have provided no evidence.

2. Are those people contracted, as professional writers, in the essay industry?

You ignorant fool who is Nikesh arora? an Indian.....

Nikesh Arora
President, Global Sales Operations and Business Development

Nikesh oversees all revenue and customer operations, as well as marketing and partnerships. Since joining Google in 2004, he has held several positions with the company. Most recently, he led Google's global direct sales operations. He also developed and managed the company's operations in the European, Middle Eastern and African markets and was responsible for creating and expanding strategic partnerships in those regions for the benefit of Google's growing number of users and advertisers.

With a background as an analyst, Nikesh's main areas of focus have been consulting, IT, marketing and finance. Prior to joining Google, he was chief marketing officer and a member of the management board at T-Mobile. While there, he spearheaded all product development, terminals, brand and marketing activities of T-Mobile Europe. In 1999, he started working with Deutsche Telekom and founded T-Motion PLC, a mobile multimedia subsidiary of T-Mobile International. Prior to joining Deutsche Telekom, Nikesh held management positions at Putnam Investments and Fidelity Investments in Boston.

Nikesh holds a master's degree from Boston College and an MBA from Northeastern University, both of which were awarded with distinction. He also holds the CFA designation. In 1989, Nikesh graduated from the Institute of Technology in Varanasi, India with a bachelor's degree in electrical engineering


You are completely ignorant fool....

I was clearly highlighting the blatant ignorance of your claim that the "top people" at Google are Indian and Pakistani. Did I claim that there are no Indians or Pakistanis in any upper-level positions at Google? No. Learn how to read, dips-i*. (By the way, from what I can tell, virtually all of the Indians at Google were educated in the US.)

You are one of the most ignorant people with whom I have ever had the distinct displeasure of communicating.

You bitc* .. Their initial education is from India...... your acceptance to this is the refutation of your claim that ESL writers are uneducated..... moron they are more educated than most of you here........

Really? Shall i show you the kind of vulgarity and random accusations and racial abuse that you and your friends use here? you are again ignoring the very question about your education? you are an ET WRITER, ET claims it hires only doctoral level writers that means you should be holding a Phd but if you are not a PhD than you and ET are cheaters........

[/quote]

We are still waiting for answer to this????? all you cheaters out there..... come out and refute this too... claim that Pheelyks- the Phat AS* is a PhD.. claim that WB and WRT Retard held a doctoral degree too...

Lots of interesting racist points from the protectionists WRT, WB et al.

However, it is a fact that good EFL writers can write FAR better than many native English speakers - particularly those from the USA who write terrible English and also have a low academic level (though they always think they are wonderful and perfect - cf WB's BS).

Americans writers are thus EFL really. Let's examine this in more details for the benefit of the Yanks WB and Phleeks and the Aussie WRT who says that an essay writer should have:

"1) English-language skills which are better than those of the average native speaker"

Oh I agree. Shame most US graduate do not fall into this catergory.

"2) A solid education"

The USA has the worst education system in the Wetsren World - an A grade there would get a C or a D in the UK. They all cheat too, and almost 70% are functionally academically illterate according to research.

"3) First-hand, experiential knowledge of the Western education system (remember, you are writing for Western educational institutions)"

Thsi is NONSENSE. A highly educated Indian in India, or Esat European, will write FAR better than most Yank graduates! Most Americans so not seem to realise how ignorant and undeucated they are when compared to Europeans, for example.

"4) An insider's knowledge and understanding of Western culture. You cannot speak as a Western student if you do not understand the West's culture or worldview. While I would not go so far as to uphold Kipling's "East is East and West is West," there are fundamental differences and, they show in a myriad of ways."

The GREAT British writer Kipling was not talking about writing essays YOU MORON!
The only thing EFL must understand is that copying - or close paraphrasing - is not allowed in the UK, and original thought and individual opinions are valued, unlike in the East. But that's all. Bear in mind too that in the US education levels are so low as to be retard level and MOST AMERICANS CHEAT AND COPY AND BUY ESSAYS to get their degrees.

Most US writers SUCK, doods!

and [The Problem with ESL Websites and Writers] is a proof of that...... a firm illegally selling essays to uneducated and racist Americans..... ET .. you are well on your way to make America as the most illiterate nation in the world.....

As there are about 80 million Americans studying for a degree at the moment, you are claiming that at least 40 million "CHEAT AND COPY AND BUY ESSAYS." The Department of Education would be very interested in your findings - care to share your research methods with us?


And most of those 40 million are ********* customers? And WB owns ET? In that case, I really think you should treat our only forum zillionaire with more respect.

IMBECILES!


Yes, with a literacy rate of 98%, Americans are uneducated and illiterate.
Racist? Most definitely! Obama's democratic election to the presidency is ample proof of their undying racism.

Lots of interesting racist points from the protectionists WRT, WB et al.

However, it is a fact that good EFL writers can write FAR better than many native English speakers - particularly those from the USA who write terrible English and also have a low academic level (though they always think they are wonderful and perfect - cf WB's BS).

Americans writers are thus EFL really. Let's examine this in more details for the benefit of the Yanks WB and Phleeks and the Aussie WRT who says that an essay writer should have:

"1) English-language skills which are better than those of the average native speaker"

Oh I agree. Shame most US graduate do not fall into this catergory.

"2) A solid education"

The USA has the worst education system in the Wetsren World - an A grade there would get a C or a D in the UK. They all cheat too, and almost 70% are functionally academically illterate according to research.

"3) First-hand, experiential knowledge of the Western education system (remember, you are writing for Western educational institutions)"

Thsi is NONSENSE. A highly educated Indian in India, or Esat European, will write FAR better than most Yank graduates! Most Americans so not seem to realise how ignorant and undeucated they are when compared to Europeans, for example.

"4) An insider's knowledge and understanding of Western culture. You cannot speak as a Western student if you do not understand the West's culture or worldview. While I would not go so far as to uphold Kipling's "East is East and West is West," there are fundamental differences and, they show in a myriad of ways."

The GREAT British writer Kipling was not talking about writing essays YOU MORON!
The only thing EFL must understand is that copying - or close paraphrasing - is not allowed in the UK, and original thought and individual opinions are valued, unlike in the East. But that's all. Bear in mind too that in the US education levels are so low as to be retard level and MOST AMERICANS CHEAT AND COPY AND BUY ESSAYS to get their degrees.

Most US writers SUCK, doods!

A competent ESL professor is more reliable than a chatty third class American or British students. Unfortunately no bright students or professors will write a page for mere $5 - $6. So those sites that claim to employ native English writers are simply liars and scams.


We can expect that an ESL professor have a good command of his/her subject. Obviously he is better than the third grade American backbenchers.


More than 55 percents of essaymill-users are ESL students. At present the East-West divide in the education system of any country is blurring. So it is not necessary for one to have experiential knowledge of the Western education system.


I have had a big piss on this view. This uncouth blunderer, WRT, will write a physics or chemistry paper from cultural point. For example, he often writes the following sentence:

In the East they eat Sodium Chloride in the curry, but in our Western culture we pour NaCl in our a$$hole

So Guys!! lets us give this cultural hog a big hand.

the proposition that WB is not someone who launches into a maniacal tirade is laugable.

some people are always so quick to defend themselves against racism-- when no one is even accusing them!

(WB is thinking right now: some people! that means me! time to sling some personal insults!)

however, face facts: you will not change anyone's mind by posting rape fantasies about them on anonymous internet posting sites with no membership screening procedures. do you not realize this?

anyway, there is no "ESL websites and writers," as a general cateogry; it is the dumbest trap you can fall into, called "stereotyping."

in other words, the title of this post belies its true nature as stereotyping... but this does not excuse the distasteful and vulgar reactions of certain individual people who need ESL lessons, rabid animals, and propagandists (Fracture, Researcher, etc.). have a nice day!

Or they pay their writers more than $5-$6 per page.


Did you just pull this statistic out of your ass? Is that why this thread smells so bad al of the sudden?


No, it isn't. At Western universities, Western theories of knowledge and rhetoric are still hugely dominant...which you would know had you ever studied at a Western institution.


Idioms like this would make a professor who actually understands and speaks English scrtach his head before returning the paper ungraded and asking you to try again.

Vulgar idiot!! if you think that I pulled it out of my a$$, yes, it is specially for you. Hello, scam (Phyleeks)!! you yourself is an ESL writer. You always lie about your identity.


Yes, your company does not pay more than $5-$6 per page,

Classic.

I concur with WRT that a person need to know about the culture , have fluency and better English skills than the native and solid education which you silently mention it. But the bottom line is the level of education the person is having.Yes you may be fluent and have a well structured research but i think in most cases the content of the research matters a lot and is the difference of obtaining marks in school. A paper written by third world person without proper education will obviously get an F , 1. because of low quality english and the argument content in the research paper 2. Similarly a high school drop out/college drop out or a dull student/graduate in US,UK or Australia will write a well structured paper in English but the argument will be very poor and subsequently get an F. But what about a paper written by an educated ESL writer experienced and fluent in english? He will have a well discussed paper and proper languange structure.

I feel that it is lying and cheating when students are told that the papers are written by Native English Writers who are educated but it happens that most of the "native english Writers" happen to be drop outs and failures from instituions. That would be a scam because the english would be good but the content and argument of a high school kid. I wonder how a person would be arguing a technical subject or a research project involving application ,guess work i think?? Maybe some sites fall under this category in native english countries.

Pheelkys: Have you checked the number of foreigners in US,UK and Australia universities? Do you have their statistics? Maybe you would wish to know their numbers. And where do you think these thousands and thousands every year go after their visa expires, back in their country where jobs sometimes its hell to get. I have been across some parts of Africa and Asia and meet with tens and tens of western educated students who are jobless and working on even less than $15 a day!! Don't you think that person will write for $4 a page if he can write 10 pages a day he will be better off and write an excellent research paper 10 times better than a college drop out or a failure in "English native countries". Blame the scam sites for exploiting and misusing the labour and sometimes encouraging uneducated folks from those countries, but i don't think it will be evil to get an educated guy in developing world who can write better and cheaper, its economics and business. The same applies to sites owned by native english guys but who are not educated enough, they cheat and lie to their clients too.

No one here would have any problem with an EFL speaker who actually has true fluency in English writing papers. It is obvious from your posts that you do not have this fluency, however; if you write papers for a living without disclosing your ESL status, you are cheating your customers. Plain and simple.


This would be upsetting and fraudulent if it were true, but it isn't at the legitimate companies.

PH Plucker Phat Leech (Phyleek), you do not even have the quality to be his student because you are a third student of Philippine.

That makes a whole lot of sense.

As I said:


In other words, there are some excellent ESL writers (education and language skills). None are opposed to their presence in the industry. The reference is to the ones who are neither educated nor capable of writing a coherent sentence in English. The same goes for website - be honest about your nationality (or do not mention it) and about your writers' qualifications.

Lots of interesting racist points from the protectionists WRT, WB et al.

However, it is a fact that good EFL writers can write FAR better than many native English speakers - particularly those from the USA who write terrible English and also have a low academic level (though they always think they are wonderful and perfect - cf WB's BS).

Americans writers are thus EFL really. Let's examine this in more details for the benefit of the Yanks WB and Phleeks and the Aussie WRT who says that an essay writer should have:

"1) English-language skills which are better than those of the average native speaker"

Oh I agree. Shame most US graduate do not fall into this catergory.

"2) A solid education"

The USA has the worst education system in the Wetsren World - an A grade there would get a C or a D in the UK. They all cheat too, and almost 70% are functionally academically illterate according to research.

"3) First-hand, experiential knowledge of the Western education system (remember, you are writing for Western educational institutions)"

Thsi is NONSENSE. A highly educated Indian in India, or Esat European, will write FAR better than most Yank graduates! Most Americans so not seem to realise how ignorant and undeucated they are when compared to Europeans, for example.

"4) An insider's knowledge and understanding of Western culture. You cannot speak as a Western student if you do not understand the West's culture or worldview. While I would not go so far as to uphold Kipling's "East is East and West is West," there are fundamental differences and, they show in a myriad of ways."

The GREAT British writer Kipling was not talking about writing essays YOU MORON!

The only thing EFL writers must understand is that copying - or close paraphrasing - is not allowed in the UK, and original thought and individual opinions are valued, unlike in the East. But that's all. Bear in mind too that in the US education levels are so low as to be retard level and MOST AMERICANS CHEAT AND COPY AND BUY ESSAYS to get their degrees.

Most US writers SUCK, doods!

Yes, but college drop-outs and "failures" shouldn't be working in the industry in the first place. I, and several others, have repeatedly emphasised that nationality is not a qualification in itself.

Pheelyks i can bet you openly to write anything i.e on my field Economics and Statistics and compare our research papers and if you get above an E i will congratulate you because i am sure the argument in your content will be in question and very cheap. Disclosing your status is posting your academic credentials to clients to know your level of education, but hiding under the pretext of native' yet you have low level of education is simple cheating. It costs nothing to post your academic credentials as they can be checked from the records of the institutions.Lying and cheating is in many forms and i think you have perfected one form of it.

These legitimate companies you claim about are the masters of practicing that habit i mentioned above. I cant write in any topic for instance, but i can argue in my field which i have experience and i don't know if you can really argue for any technical discusion

WRT
If you have emphasized on that issue ,then that will be a genuine argument. But how would you know the level of education of that person and he/she is writing English fluently and has registered his company in US or UK.Wouldn't you say that the person is genuine and has a legitimate company?

Isn't that what we are doing? If a writer is qualified (education, language and research skills), should he/she get paid less than would a similarly qualified American writer? Should uneducated people be hired just because they are American or British? That's what the scam sites do and that is what many here oppose.

How can you say that they are from America (yanks)? WB is a Russian immigrant in the USA.

WRT - those with your awful level of English should not be writing essays for anyone either, LOSER! Your Australian English is a joke, as is WB's retarded English level. EFL writers are FAR better than illiterates like you. TWERP!

WRT
Of course it will be exploitation and misuse if a site pays a person $2 or $4 a page and he has sacrificed everything to ensure the paper is of quality. That is exploitation and would not support it also and would condemn those scam sites exploiting people.

What????!!!!!! I genuinely don't understand what you are trying to say here.


You are `sure'? Is there a basis for your supposed certitude?

If I understand you correctly, you want Pheelyks to scan and upload a copy of his academic degrees here? Right here on this forum? Actually, I agree and believe that he should also post his Social Security number and home address. How else would we know that he is American?


Qualified academic writers should not be earning $6 and $7 per page, either.


Psycho, it's simple. Stop reading our awful posts.

Terrible English articulation of a college drop-out Aussie!!! Can anybody please explain what this inarticulate idiot is trying to say?