It's not just the consumers that have to be on the look out for scams. Writers can be scammed also, by doing work and not being paid for it. I honestly don't see what's wrong with this thread. Finding out which sites will actually pay instead of scamming me out of my hard work is exactly why I came to this site. You seem to be the main poster on this message board, for whatever reason. I just signed up today and have been perusing some discussions. Some of your posts are informative but I really don't understand your objection to the nature of this thread.

1. Neither I nor anyone else had mentioned anything about the rules of the forum in this thread, and so far as I can tell nobody in this thread has broken any rules, so the remark that I don't have to participate if I don't like the rules is not only rude, but irrelevant.

2. I know what the name of the site is, and as I said in my previous post, consumers are not the only ones trying to avoid the SCAMS. The writers can get SCAMMED too. I guess I should have capitalized SCAM in my first post so you'd get the point.

3. You already mentioned the freelance writing sites, and now you do it again, which shows you just don't get the point. We would-be essay writers want to know which ones will SCAM us out of our work.

I'm not saying this site is a scam, but it sure seems shady when a message board supposedly devoted to exposing scams in the essay writing industry doesn't allow you to post the names of many of the businesses in question.

Does anyone know of any better sites for discussing this sort of thing, where we're not restricted this way?

I mean, think of it this way:

Some of the essay writing companies might scam customers, some might scam writers, some might scam both.

Potential customers might come here to discuss which ones are legitimate places to shop for papers. If someone asked about that, I guess you wouldn't have a problem with it, WB.

Likewise, potential writers might come here to discuss which ones are legitimate places to find work as a writer, where you won't send them a paper and not get paid. You seem to have a problem with somebody asking about this.

But in either case, it's simply a matter of someone asking for advice from those with previous experience about whether or not they'll get scammed by an essay writing business, which is what this site seems to be about.

Rash comments? I didn't really make any assertions about anything. You're right, I don't understand all the legal implications/justifications involved. You'll notice I said it was confusing. I'm definitely not claiming to be an expert on such issues. I'm not saying anything wrong is being done here, but that it kind of seems that way. I said it SEEMS shady. So, to summarize my point, I don't know what's up with not being able to mention the businesses, but something about it SEEMS fishy to me. Whether it is in fact fishy I am unsure, which is pretty much why I started a thread to discuss it.

WritersBeware, you make some good points in some threads but you also have a habit of attacking people over things they didn't actually say. I don't know if you just misunderstand a lot of what you read or if you intentionally misinterpret, but your skills at attacking straw men impress nobody.

So just whom is this site supposed to help when it comes to avoiding scams? If it's not for potential customers of these businesses to avoid getting scammed as a customer, and it's not for potential writers to avoid being scammed as employers, then what the heck is the point of uncovering the scams? Is it for completely uninvolved people who are just curious about essay writing scams? Surely not.

Ha! From the homepage of this website, under the question "What are essayscam's goals?", the first paragraph is as follows:

"EssayScam.org exists to help students, other essay-writing companies, and academic freelance writers by discussing their experiences with online essay writing and research services, freelance writers, or students (their clients) to improve their services."

This sort of thread is exactly what this site is about, ignore writers beware.

And a little more from the section "What are essayscam's goals?":

"We just want students, writers, and other essay writing company owners to share their real-life and oftentimes humorous stories so that potential customers or writers are able to tell the difference."

Best essays from a writer's point of view?

Anyone have any experience writing for best essays? I've been considering trying to write for them.

By the way, before a certain person posts and tells me about fake addresses and criminal records, just keep it to yourself because that's not what I'm asking and that info is already available in plenty of threads here.

I'm just asking if they'll pay me for my work and not rip me off. Any help would be greatly appreciated. If you think they'll rip me off, do you know of one that won't? By the way, the phrase "best essays" isn't technically the name of any business on the list of those whose names shall not be spoken, so I don't want any crap about rule violation either.

Actually, I only mentioned you here because you'd already been attacking me in other forums, as well as others. From what I've seen, you jump into every discussion and attack everyone.

Please tell me exactly where it says that reviews and recommendations are not allowed. I'm not saying you're lying, I just want to see it.

From essayscam.org:

"Is providing positive feedback allowed?

While advertising or promoting any particular service or professional writer is not allowed, providing genuine positive feedback is always welcome, so long as it is not the only goal of the poster and is not an "advertisement in disguise." Because it can be tricky at times to determine if any given message is an advertisement or not, the final decision belongs to moderators."

I've already said it. I could be wrong, but it seems as though you were responding to someone who was outright criticizing the rule about certain business names, and were attacking me for lack of knowledge about the legal issues involved, when in fact I was just raising a question about the practice and openly admitting that I found it confusing. You responded like someone being attacked when there was no attack.

Nobody was asking for an advertisement or trying to advertise. People were trying to discuss their own experiences writing for these companies with each other to figure out which ones will scam them and which ones won't. That's not advertising. That's just sharing your own stories which as I showed earlier is one of the purposes of this site. If the essayscam mods decide to interpret it as advertising, that's up to them and we can't really stop them, but until then why can't you just let people have the sort of discussion this site is intended for, a place where "students, writers, and other essay writing company owners to share their real-life and oftentimes humorous stories so that potential customers or writers are able to tell the difference."

Well come on, in one of my threads you put this very lengthy post containing someone's criminal record, and it wasn't even relevant to that particular post. It was kind of distracting from the main topic, so I didn't appreciate it, especially since it's information that you've already posted elsewhere. And by the way, isn't that kind of the same as what you're berating me for here, posting something asking for information that's already been posted. That makes you a bit of a hypocrit. And besides, just because I post a request for information doesn't mean I'm not simultaneously doing research of my own. I just thought the responses would provide further help and perhaps be more up to date. Why must you hijack each and every thread? Why must you take part in every discussion here? You're totally allowed, but it just seems rude.

So it's against the rules for people to share their own stories?

So there's something wrong with admitting it's possible I could have misinterpreted as well?

It's not a cloak of ignorance, it's an admission of non-omniscience.

Every answer you give has already been given in this forum, by you.

Once again, I made no assumptions or assertions, just raised a question and indicated why it seemed like a good question to raise.

There is no such thing as "supposed to" so don't pretend there is.

Once again, I did not make statements about the site but rather raised a question. I did make a statement about myself and how something SEEMED to ME. To say that something seems fishy to me is not to make a statement about its legitimacy.

Also, I never said that would-be essay writers have no interest in or connection to freelance writing sites. I said that by repeatedly mentioning those sites you were missing the point of the thread. If I'm trying to find out if the freelance writing site is a scam, I'm not just going to go to that freelance writing site. I might even go to a forum where people discuss scams related to freelance writing, such as this one. This is a site for potential customers and potential employees to discuss essay writing businesses to determine which ones will scam you, based on information from other people's accounts of their own experiences with these companies.

Also, why not just respond to that thread in that thread, instead of bringing that debate into this debate? I'll argue with you, but let's keep it organized.

My only inquiries have been about the writing side of things, as that's the only part of this I'm interested in. I don't need to buy papers but I'd like to write them for money. I'm willing to respond to your points but please keep them accurate.

Fine, prove that I only inquired about the consumer side of things.

Of course, that's irrelevant anyway, because there's nothing wrong with that either. Both are in line with the rules and intended purpose of this site, as I have proven in another thread and you even agreed with eventually.

Ok, so you admit that I am right about the current rules and you can see that what you've been saying over and over about the rules is actually incorrect, but you can't understand why someone would think the guy tell falsehoods over and over is a fool, and in return decide that I must be the fool? Hilarious. I don't blame forum regulars if they don't go to the home page often, there's nothing wrong with that. But if you don't actually want to check and make sure you're not wrong about the current rules before trying to enforce what you believe to be the rules, then something is wrong with that. But it seems the issue is settled and I hope you'll no longer tell people they can't discuss their own experiences. I also hope you'll let the mods do their job when it comes to decided what is and isn't advertising. If they don't like a post, they are free to delete it. But you are not a mod. I wish you luck with exposing frauds and sharing useful information, but please stop interrupting people who are doing nothing worse than using this site for one of its intended purposes.

My point about capitalizing the word "scam" was that you emphasized the name of the site was essay scams, not essaysuggest, essaypromote, etc. My point was that we understand that this site is about scams, and that we were talking about avoiding scams. Let's try to turn these into more fruitful discussions.

1. Using multiple resources is often better than just one.

2. Now that you know what it says on the homepage, perhaps this site will be more useful.

Even when you admit you're wrong, you can't admit that you admitted it. When you finally acknowledged that what I was saying about the rules was right (which implies that what you were saying was wrong), that's admitting you're wrong. I understand if you were going by old rules and didn't realize that things had changed, and that as someone who just came to the site yesterday and saw the rules I had that advantage. It's not my fault the mods didn't notify you of the changes. But the fact is, the rules are what they are, despite whatever they were, and I was talking about what the rules are now, not what they used to be.

Also, I get what you're saying about people lying about the companies, claiming to have been paid by them. I know that's a possibility. I know that people lie, and I know people lie a lot online. But I'm a grown up and I have a right to check out all the responses and see what I think. The company can have 50 people come on and lie about getting paid, but if just one person tells me they didn't then I won't work with that company. Of course, that person could be a liar too, but I'm going to be very cautious about such things so any bad feedback is pretty much a dealbreaker for me. And I realize that in many cases we're not allowed to tell each other the name of the particular site, but we can still discuss this using initials and such, or by exchanging email addresses if so desired. We are adults and have a right to hear from many sources and decide which ones to believe. If that sometimes leads to a mistake, then so be it; we have the right to make that mistake.

Yes, I wanted to hear any positive feedback someone might have from their personal experience as a writer for such companies. That's allowed.


What, can't back it up?

Ha ha, I love winning.

No, it's ok, I'll quote you, from the other thread:


It seemed to me you were telling me to leave this site and go to the "five million other sites that special in freelance writing jobs and information," while I was wanting to know which of these sites were scammers. That's why it seemed irrelevant when you brought it up the first time, and why I thought you didn't get my point when you brought it up a second time. If I was wrong, then please specify, what exactly were you saying about these freelance writing sites.

Fine, we can still exchange contact information if so desired. And unless/until the mods delete the post, it might still be useful.

Glad to see you don't "resort to attacks, insults, and name-calling" like we do.

By the way, this isn't advertising: the yahoo group isn't about making money, it's just a complimentary site to ones like this one, a place to spread the discussion. I plan to also direct people from that site to this one, once some people join. If the mods consider this advertising, I understand and won't complain if they take it down.

Yeah it's cool how you criticize people for something while doing it yourself. Really cool.

Essay writers, I need advice

I'm trying to get started with one of these businesses as an essay writer, but I don't know which one to use. I don't want to get ripped off by someone who doesn't pay me for my work, I just want to make a little extra money to pay the bills. Since many of the people here seem to have done this type of work before, I'd love to hear what feedback you guys have on these places from the writer/employee point of view. Telling your own stories is allowed here, and giving positive feedback isn't the same as advertising. Let's avoid explicitly mentioning names that are on the "Do Not Discuss" list, but that doesn't mean we can't get our points across. Let's not argue about the rules either, the mods can take care of enforcing the rules. Let's just have a friendly, productive discussion on where to make a little money as essay writers without getting scammed.

Don't like to get what you give?

Dude, you've interrupted and sidetracked every thread I've posted. I was just trying to avoid getting ripped off but you kept telling us what we couldn't talk about. It was frustrating, especially when we were in line with the rules.

It's not in the trash, you idiot, I just came to it again through the list of posts. Yes, I am arguing with you in multiple threads, and you're arguing with me in multiple threads. I was only rude after you tried to enforce false rules. You were the one proven wrong when you finally realized you were going by old rules that are no longer in place, and then whined because the rules recently changed and the mods didn't notify you in the forum. You had to keep disrupting my attempt to ask certain questions, saying we weren't allowed to talk about such things and that the answers would be advertisements because any positive review is, according to you, a advertisement. Now you're saying that you would have answered if I hadn't been rude. But that means you would have been doing what you were telling others not to do. You may think I was rude first, but I found it rude that you posted a very long criminal record of that yuri guy in one of my threads. Sure, that info is useful but you've already posted it elsewhere, and it was unnecessary to take up so much space of my thread with it. I don't know why you don't want my questions answered, and I really don't know why you are now pretending as though you would have answered them.

Ok, so let's trace this back. You're saying this started when you first tried to help. Remind me, what help was that? I'm totally serious here, let's figure out where this crap started. Maybe it was just a miscommunication.

I know about the rules about the names. That's not the rule I'm talking about. I'm talking about when you tried to say something along the lines of any positive review/feedback being advertising and therefore not allowed, when in fact such feedback is one purpose of this site.

I know about the yuri guy, I read several posts before making any of my own. But the thing is, that guy is bound to post in some threads here and there. We can ignore his short post and take it with a grain of salt.

I understand responding when he attacks you, but his response in my thread wasn't an attack on you. I get why you do, but like I said, I'd already seen it (and yes, like you said, that was in previous posts by you), and would rather just ignore him than have to scroll through his lengthy criminal record to see others' responses. Anyway, we each have our reasons.

Thanks for the response. Here's what I don't get: Positive feedback and the sharing of personal experiences with these businesses is allowed. I've been told recommendations are not allowed. So how does this work? I can say I had a positive experience with a certain company as long as I don't technically recommend them? And where is the rule about no recommendations? So long as the company isn't on the do not discuss list, why can't we discuss them?

And please, don't take my questions as me trying to start a fight, they are honest questions.

[Moved from]: Wondering about UrgentCustomEssays

I checked and urgentcustomessays.com isn't on the "Do Not Discuss" list, so this should be ok. I did a search and only found one thread that mentioned them. Anyone have any experience writing for them? They don't have a link for people interested in writing for them, but they do give contact info so I guess I can inquire. I'm just wondering if it's even worth the effort to contact them or if they'll just rip me off by not paying. Any help will be appreciated.

But positive feedback from someone else isn't advertising. And positive feedback is allowed.

I don't have to justify my posts, I'm just trying to get answers. It's obvious from the home page that we are allowed to give positive feedback and share our personal experiences with these businesses. WB, I honestly think you might be one of the ones who can help clear this up, if you so wish. Either way, let's not turn it into another fight.